John Liddy on leadership: ‘See it from their point of view’

John Liddy likes to say he’s a recovering entrepreneur. Instead of starting his own ventures, for the past 20 years he has helped other people start and grow businesses in Syracuse.

Liddy has done that in a variety of roles: college professor, consultant, entrepreneur in residence, business incubator director, and, for the past two-plus years, as vice president for innovation and entrepreneurship at CenterState CEO.

“My goal here is to start more companies than we lose in Syracuse,” he says.

Liddy’s efforts are in for a big boost. The business development group is building a $32 million “Innovation Hub” at Warren and Harrison streets that incorporates its former Tech Garden. The hub doubles both its size, to 90,000 square feet, and the number of companies it can serve. There will be spaces for makers, hardware assembly, video and audio production, co-working and events. Amenities include an outdoor terrace, a drone launchpad and the obligatory game room.

Since 2005, the Tech Garden nurtured hundreds of companies, sparked innovation through its Genius NY competition and even launched a couple of unicorns (startups valued over $1 billion). “We’ve gotten beyond just sprinkling some seeds,” Liddy says. The name no longer fits. A new one will be announced April 23 at CenterState’s annual meeting.

Liddy grew up on Syracuse’s West Side. He graduated from Corcoran High School and the University of Vermont, then moved to Washington, D.C., to start a series of businesses. His mother, former Syracuse University iSchool dean Elizabeth Liddy, was starting her own business, TextWise, and kept calling him for advice. In 1994, she invited him to come home to work with her. “I never looked back,” he says.

Liddy, 57, oversees a staff of nine. He and his wife, Jen, live in Syracuse and have an 18-year-old son. Our conversation has been edited for length and clarity.

Tell me briefly about your journey to this role.

I’m a recovering entrepreneur. I sold my fifth company on 9/11. After that, I went into the corporate world. I got recruited by an MBA classmate to do training in an oil and gas company, migrated into operations in that organization, and then got let go for being entrepreneurial. … The next month I was approached by the then-Chamber of Commerce and Syracuse University to start an accelerator for students that were considering entrepreneurship, the Student Sandbox. … It went well. We ran it for about four or five years [until other colleges created their own incubators]. That was the beginning of my entrepreneurial coaching business in 2009. Then I became the entrepreneur in residence for the Genius NY program. I started the Keenan Center at Le Moyne College, the thINCubator in Utica. I still work with the HUSTLE Defense Accelerator at the Griffiss Institute in Rome. And then about two years ago … I joined CenterState and here I am today.

You’re the third member of your family to be featured in this column, after your mom (the former SU iSchool dean) and your wife (consultant/coach Jen Liddy). How did being around them make you a better leader?

Obviously, I’ve been around my mom my whole life. I’ve worked with her in two different businesses. I’ve seen her hands-on leadership skills, and I appreciated that. She always engendered opportunities for people who worked for her. There was a lot of rope given; there weren’t significant negative consequences if something went wrong. [Liz Liddy would hand out “get out of jail free” cards like the ones from Monopoly.] You’d get a pass. The goal there was to take chances. You don’t have to stay within the guardrails the whole time. Entrepreneurs take risks; they take mitigated risks. They understand what the downside is going to be. She really shared that whole vision.

My wife is the best communicator I’ve ever met — understanding how you’re sharing your vision, how you’re telling people why you’re doing it, not just doing it. There’s a lot of that intentionality I’ve learned over my 20 years of marriage to her.

Jen gave you a great compliment: “He hires good people, and he lets them do their job. He leads with questions.” What did she mean?

Why wouldn’t you? I just don’t understand the other side. It sounds [flippant]. I don’t mean to be. If you’re doing other people’s job for them, you’re not being efficient. I always believe A’s hire A’s, B’s hire C’s. A’s have the confidence in the other person’s ability to do [the task] and their own capability to coach if it didn’t go right. I’ve dealt with thousands of companies, and young managers fall victim to this if they escalated into a role where they’re now managing instead of an individual contributor, and they want it done the way they did it. That’s hard — because people don’t do things the same, they may mess up, they may do it better, and you have to be OK with that. I find the role of coaching versus telling is way more efficient, and it works much better.

Were you in leadership roles growing up? Who or what influenced your leadership abilities?

I had an uncle, Gil DuRoss, who once compared me to my dad, John P. Liddy. He said: There’s got to be the person in the group of friends who can go rent the car. I’m that guy.

You mean, the one taking responsibility?

Yeah. In my peer groups, high school, college, throughout my whole life. I went on a trip with friends last year. I just tended to lean into that. It’s an organizational thing. It’s a control thing, I’m sure, at some level. And it’s an empathetic thing, making sure everyone’s good. I’ve had it just by some nature my whole life.

The Tech Garden incubated a couple of unicorns. Most startups don’t succeed that spectacularly — or at all. Can you put your finger on what distinguishes the successes from the failures?

If I take a look at the unicorns locally, the common aspects of them are:

Leadership: Most times the founder does not end up being the CEO. They end up migrating to a technical role, or perhaps an advising role, because they just don’t have that capability. In each of these cases, the CEO is still there.

They had excellent leadership on the founder side. They built the organization while they built the business. They stayed the same, but they would also level up in their support in the C-suite. [They would say,] we got to a certain level of sales. We’re doing deals at enterprise level. Maybe you’re not the chief financial officer anymore. Maybe we need [more expertise]. They are really intentional about growing their organization alongside their business.

They’re always forward-looking. You have to see what’s around the corner, make sure you have the staff and capability internally to do that. Then you can withstand market corrections, or things like that.

Would you rather have a home run or a bunch of singles?

Can I say doubles?

I would certainly say singles. Home runs are great, but they tend to be vanity. A lot of organizations use vanity metrics: “We have X amount of dollars raised.” And I want the next person to be able to start a business. I would just as soon work with a pizza shop owner than a 400-person organization. My goal, like I said, is to start more businesses than we lose, and that really bridges the spectrum. If you just concentrate on the home runs, you lose on the bottom side. That being said, we’ve got to make sure we’re celebrating those home runs and see make sure we’re showing that as an opportunity for other entrepreneurs.

What advice would you give for effective leadership, especially for a new leader or for someone aspiring to take on leadership responsibilities?

Seek to understand. A lot of times people take leadership roles, and they want to put their stamp on it, versus understanding. In one of my roles, I had about 50 people reporting to me, drivers and technicians. I did ride-alongs to understand their jobs. I didn’t need to do it, but I needed to understand where they were coming from. Alan Kay, a computer scientist out of Silicon Valley, has this saying I use a lot: “Point of view is worth 80 IQ points.” And so, if you’re empathetic and can see from their point of view, it’s going to really help you understand them. It’s going to help you lead them.

The other part of that, for young leaders especially, is how to say no. … We can’t always do what everyone wants. … When you say no, give them a reason. It could be budget. It could be strategy. You’re inviting them into that process. … [The next time,] I’m empowering those individuals to convince me.

How can a leader spark innovation in an organization?

Allow for curiosity. Don’t be Dr. No. Default to yes. Put parameters around it so people aren’t going down rabbit holes. That requires systemic check-ins. We do stand-ups once a week. That gives everybody an opportunity to say, this is what I have going on this week. Understanding of roles cross-pollinates. It also gives the opportunity for people to say, hey, I have this hurdle or this idea. I get new ideas every day. Being an innovative space, you tend to do that. We’re providing the framework … to explore.

What’s the best advice that a parent, a mentor or a boss ever gave you?

It’s probably that “get out of jail free” card by my mom. She grew up in an entrepreneurial family, they sold the dining room furniture to make payroll once. So, there’s an understanding of risk.

… From my dad’s side, I would say integrity, always be able to look yourself in the mirror. There are many times where you say to yourself, it’s not going to help me, it’s going to hurt me, but it’s the right thing to do. That sounds trite, but it’s a life lesson that I think is really true. One of my proudest things is seeing my son be the same way. He’s going to do the right thing. He’s a kind guy.

What advice would you give to a person starting a career now?

Default to yes.

I keep coming back to Nike. “Just do it.” If it fails tomorrow, you’re going to be 20. Life gets … lifey. If you try it early, you’ll learn a lot from your failures. I don’t subscribe to the notion that failure is awesome because you learn. Failure sucks, but you still learn. I would say, just do it. Get out there and try it.

Be coachable, but not all the way coachable. You want to take advice, but you want to have a North Star. Here’s my vision, here’s how I’m going to get there.

Identify people who can provide you with good advice. Learn how to synthesize advice because you can get whiplash.

Don’t be defensive. People aren’t accusing you or saying you’re wrong. They’re talking about your idea. Young entrepreneurs have a tough time sharing their ideas because they don’t want to hear their baby called ugly. You’ve got to be open to that. Some of the best founders I’ve ever worked with, they go to the hardest person in the room to talk to and see what they say, and they really appreciate the criticality that comes to it. Younger people don’t always have that bandwidth.

If you could go back in time, what would you tell your younger self?

It’s going to be OK. The amount of times you stay up at night fretting … well, fretting payroll stinks. But sometimes failure happens and be OK with that. If I’ve done something wrong, I am very slow to [forgive myself]. If you could let things wash off of you easier, I would suggest that. I’m still working on that.

You grew up here and lived here most of your life. Ever consider leaving? Why do you stay?

My wife calls me Grandpa Syracuse. When the Upstate Capital Group was having a meeting in town, they wanted to do a walking tour. I very happily tour guided the folks. I’m a homer.

It used to be that people would move for opportunity. That’s flipping. We’re getting more inbound job creation versus outgoing, which is fantastic. And I’m OK with the weather. The people here are fantastic. And so, I have no interest in moving elsewhere. Our retirement plan is to spend little bits of time in other places, then most of the time here.

If you had a magic wand, what would you change about Syracuse?

Ingrained pessimism.

Years ago, when I was with TextWise, I participated in something called the DaVinci Project to attract engineers. The local high tech firms were just cannibalizing each other. Go to Chicago. Yeah, it’s windy. No one’s [complaining] about it. Toughen up, buttercup. …

I get asked about Micron every day. Is it really going to happen? Is it really going to happen? Is it really going to happen? Without betraying confidences, I just very positively react, yeah, it’s going to happen.

The weekly “Conversation on Leadership” features Q&A interviews about leadership, success and innovation. To suggest a candidate for Conversations on Leadership, email Marie Morelli at [email protected]. Read previous entries in the series.